Tribal Island reset issue

Introduction

This reset issue has been a huge problem ever since Tribal Island began in 2015, and has been debated by a lot of players ever since. For clarification, I would like to define a few terms that I will be using here in this post.

> Reset – This is the period when all tribes begin having their scores reset to zero. It begins immediately after the timer winds down to zero each week. The timer currently hits zero at 1:00 am (EST) on Monday morning (DST). When the time changes, the timer will bottom out at 12:00 am on Sunday night (The reset is constant year round. Our time changes, but the reset does not). As tribes are reset, they are immediately removed from the next scoreboard update.

* Please note * – There is never a brand new scoreboard for each new week. It is always a constant scoreboard that always shows the current tribes with the highest total levels at that given point. The scoreboard never resets to zero. This is why some of the lower leveling tribes rise up to the top of the scoreboard every week before they are reset.

The order that tribes are reset is based on each tribe’s age, with the older tribes getting reset first.

> Updates – Scoreboard updates. These occur once per hour throughout every day of the week. The scoreboard shows the highest level tribes at that particular point in time. The update times ‘shift’ throughout the week, slightly at each update. To gauge the exact update time for the final full update, it is best to check the update time on the day of the reset. That will be the most accurate time.

> Final Full Update – This is the final update that is shown each week before the reset begins. This is the last update that does not have any tribes removed from it yet. This is the scoreboard that is showing when the timer winds down to zero each week. All subsequent updates will have some tribes removed already, with each new corrupt update having less and less tribe scores showing from the previous week. Several hours later, after all of the tribes have been reset, the scoreboard will finally have been cleansed of all tribe scores from the previous week.

> Corrupt updates – These updates come after the reset begins. All scoreboard updates that come after the timer winds down to zero are corrupt – some/many tribes have already been removed. All of these corrupt updates have tribes removed that have already been reset. On average, there are usually 7 or 8 tribes that have already been removed from the 1st corrupt update each week. This number varies, depending on exactly when the updates are occurring. The longer it is after the top of the hour that the updates are occurring, the more tribes that will have already been removed from the corrupt update. It is difficult to know exactly how many tribes will have been removed from the first corrupt update. This past week, that number was higher than average. The 1st corrupt update on 4/10/17 already had 12 tribes removed (reset).

Please note: Nearly half of the tribes were removed from the scoreboard on the 1st corrupt update! The corrupt update didn’t look anything at all like the LEGITIMATE scoreboard!

Top 30 tribe score records

I have been keeping records of the top 30 tribe scores for Harmonious Bliss since September of 2015. I began keeping the records in order to gauge the strength of the other tribes for future competition. By comparing the historical record, I could closely estimate their future abilities. We kept these records closely guarded for a very long time. We did not want to share this information with any of the other tribes. It was work that we did for ourselves that we wanted to keep for our own use and advantage. But since then, we have decided to open up our records to the MSM community for various reasons. Those top 30 tribe score records can be seen here: Top tribe scores

During my endeavor to record the top 30 tribe scores each week, I learned a few things early on:

> The final full update is the only possible way to keep FAIR records of all of the top 30 scores. If I tried to use any of the corrupt updates, many tribes would not be shown in the records. Some of the older tribes would never show up in the records. NADN’s is a perfect example of this, among others. NADN’s never shows up on the first corrupt update. NADN’s is among the earliest that reset since they are a very old tribe. They would never be given any credit for any of their accomplishments if the corrupt scoreboards were used.

> It is impossible to combine two different scoreboards into one (Final full update + 1st corrupt update). I have challenged a lot of SPFC members to try this! None of them have ever attempted to try it. Or maybe they did, but then saw that it was impossible to do. Either way, they have never admitted to trying.

There is an average of 7 to 8 tribes removed from the 1st corrupt update each week. Many of the tribes beneath those have frequently added levels to put them higher than the tribe that was removed.

For instance: Tribe-A was at 3000, and Tribe-B was at 2999, and they are at 25th and 26th places respectively. On the first corrupt update, Tribe-A gets removed, but Tribe-B moves up to 3010. Where do you reinsert Tribe A back into the records? The final full update shows Tribe-A as the leader. We do not know how many levels Tribe-A might have added if they had been allowed to remain on the scoreboard. Maybe they would have moved up to 3020. Who knows how high Tribe-A might have leveled up to? We have no way of knowing. But we do know that Tribe-B moved up ahead of Tribe-A’s earlier score, according to the corrupt update. So where do you reinsert Tribe-A back into the records? Will you reinsert them back at 25th place (ahead of Tribe-B), with 3000? Even though Tribe-B made it to 3010 on the corrupt update? Or, should Tribe-A drop to 26th place since Tribe-B unfairly moved up ahead of Tribe-A?

It is also impossible to assign the top 30 tribe positions to 38 different tribes. Due to the corrupt scoreboard (which removes some tribes and adds some tribes to take their place), we find that we are now attempting to squeeze 38 tribes into the top 30 tribe spots (on average), which is impossible. This past week, we would have needed to squeeze 42 tribes into the top 30 tribe spots. We need a magician to help us with that!

It really is not a big surprise to me that we have this variation of opinion about which final scores to use, and which are fairest. Since I have spent time keeping records, I was able to see the problems that resulted from trying to combine multiple scoreboards. It was very easy for me to come to the conclusion that the corrupt scoreboard could not be used.

SPFC has never made any attempt to keep any records. Therefore, they have no experience with trying to piece together different scoreboards. But it is never too late to try! My challenge is still open to any SPFC member. Please give this a try! Try to combine both of the scoreboards into one. Please show me how to squeeze 38 tribes into 30 spots.

Harmonious Bliss respects the effort and work of ALL tribes; not just the top two!

Harmonious Bliss respects the work and effort put into the game by all of the top 30 tribes each week. We are the true “fair play” team that actually does believe in fair play – for all! We want to recognize each of the tribes that have managed to make it into the real top 30 each week. We do not think that tribes should be penalized simply because they are older.

History of the reset issue

As a top tribe, Harmonious Bliss encountered this reset issue very early on. We are likely among the very first ones to identify it. In 2015, we ran across this issue when competing against Millennium Falcon one time. And in 2016, we had this problem with SPFC three times.

** Please note: I will not name any names here. But I will insert initials for those of you in the know to understand who I am talking about. **

J.F. attempted to try to build a tribal group page in 2016 in the hopes that this issue and a couple of other issues could be resolved and agreed upon among the various chiefs. I was friends with J.F. at that time, and was trying to help her build this neutral group page. Her attempt was sunk by S.G. and F.Z. though. They thought it was going to be a biased and partial group page. J.F. eventually wound up closing that group page, much to my disappointment.

Since then, J.F. has joined forces with SPFC. She has again created a new tribal group page. I’m not sure of the reason for this new attempt though. It is clearly biased now, and certainly not neutral this time. And there is no longer any effort being placed on resolving any of these issues now.

J.F. used to agree with my position on this reset issue. Whether she has forgotten or changed her mind, I don’t know. But she definitely did claim to agree with my position in the past. This was one of the very important goals that we had set for creating her Tribal group page last year. This is why I was motivated to help her. I believed that it would be for the betterment of Tribal Island competition if we could all agree on the finish line being used. I had full confidence that I could persuade most people to agree with my position after presenting the facts.

After J.F. quit her initial attempt at a Tribal group page last year, she joined SPFC shortly after. I continued to talk with her after that. For a little while, I was sharing the update times with J.F. in the hopes that SPFC would conform to the same finish line that we were using, since J.F. did used to agree with me. There for a while, this issue seemed to disappear. My assumption was that SPFC had begun to accept where the fair finish line was.

I have had multiple discussions/debates about this issue with various SPFC members over the last 14+ months. Among those, I have talked to J.F., P.V., S.G., and Michael (something), and probably more (I can’t remember – I have talked about this so many times!). This is not a new issue to SPFC. They have been very well aware of HB’s position about this for a very long time now. They know exactly where HB believes the fair finish line is.

We guarded against a final surge until we crossed the fair finish line at 33 minutes after on 4/10/17. That is when the final full update occurred (with 27 minutes left on the timer), with all competing tribes still present. We had millions of shards ready to defend our win.

This is the final full update from 4/10/17. This is the last update that has all tribes still present. The corrupt update that follows has HB and eleven other tribes removed from the scoreboard already.

Final full update

On 4/10/17, SPFC chose to revert back to their old ways. They knew they could not beat us fairly, so they resorted to their old cheap trick. We did see them using their unfair tactic as they moved up with 5 minutes left on the timer, but decided to stand on our principled belief in fairness. We could have easily leveled up to beat them. We were prepared. But we chose to continue playing for the same fair scoreboard that we have always played to for the last year and a half. We know that the corrupt scoreboard has multiple tribes removed, and is not a fair finish line to use.

If a team can truly win, why would they wait until the corrupt scoreboard to make their move anyway? Either way, we knew that our old HB tribe would be removed from the corrupt update. It made no sense to spend millions of shards with no scoreboard to show for it.

SPFC should have timed the updates in advance, as we did. And they should have timed their surge a few minutes earlier so that the result would show up on the final full update. Then there would be no question about who the winner was. It is really very simple to do. It is no different than the surge they planned; only timed differently to coincide with the final full update.

If SPFC had timed their surge for 28 minutes earlier, none of this discussion or debate would be necessary. There would not be any question about who won. SPFC would have had a scoreboard that they could hold up as proof that they beat us. Their scoreboard would have shown them in 1st place, and HB in 2nd place.

SPFC refuses to do this. Rather than take that very simple step, they think that all of the other competing tribes should all switch to younger islands! The problems with this idea are:

  • Many tribes still have some non-communicating members that cannot move to a new island.
  • If everybody did switch to a new island, could this turn into an endless cycle of moving to younger islands? After all, if everybody moved to new islands, then the oldest of the ‘young’ islands might begin resetting before the corrupt update. There will always need to be tribes that are first to reset. They would need to move again to get even younger.
  • This is a lot of work for a whole lot of people. On 4/10/17, there were 12 tribes that reset before the corrupt update. There are likely at least 15 to 20 tribes that commonly make it into the top 30 that are subject to being reset before the corrupt update. 20 tribes multiplied by 30 accounts equals at least 600 accounts that would need to move to new tribes according to SPFC’s plan.

Wouldn’t it be simpler and easier for SPFC to just time their surges with the final full updates? We have done this a few times ourselves. It is not hard. It is very easy.

Questions for SPFC

So if I understand SPFC correctly, they say they won because they consider that however high a tribe’s score is before they reset – that’s all that matters. I have an interesting question that I want to ask. Please bear with me.

This is the first corrupt update that came 33 minutes after time was up on 4/10/17:

Corrupt update

  • As you can see, Harmonious Bliss and 2 other front page tribes have already reset, and have already been removed. HB reset with a final score of 6800. HB ended its week with a score of 6800.
  • SPFC says they won because they finished their week with a higher score. But that is incorrect! SPFC did not finish their week with a higher score. This is the score that SPFC finished their week with:

Lower score

One person left SPFC before the tribe reset. SPFC’s score dropped to 6541.

HB ended their week with a score of 6800. HB reset with a score of 6800.

SPFC ended their week with a score of 6541. SPFC reset with a score of 6541.

Now this is my question to SPFC: Isn’t 6541 your REAL final tribe score, based on the finish line that you favor? You favor a finish line that goes well beyond when the timer runs out. You do not think a tribe needs to be shown on the scoreboard for their score to be authenticated through the Friend’s Tribes tab. You have always said this.

6541 was your final score based on your standard that you use. You not only lost according to where we see the finish line as being, you also lost your own finish line as well.

Sports

I like to use sports analogies when talking about this reset issue. Most major sports also use scoreboards.

Let’s take soccer for instance.

When time expires, the game is over. When the game is over, everybody can look immediately at the scoreboard to instantly see who won. The players then head off the field toward the locker rooms. The fans all go home.

They don’t stand around on the field waiting for 33 minutes for a new scoreboard that has their competitor removed. That would be silly. If this had been a soccer game, SPFC would have been the only team remaining on the corrupt scoreboard that updated 33 minutes after the match was over. How can you claim to beat somebody if only 1 team is showing up on the scoreboard?

The winner is shown on the scoreboard at the very instant when time expires. 

All of these discussions and arguments about which corrupt update to use, missing tribes from the scoreboard, trying to validate scores through the Friend’s Tribes tab, everybody moving to younger islands, etc. could all be avoided if SPFC would simply play to the fair finish line for everybody – the final full update. None of us would have to spend any time arguing about this.

BBB could fix this problem

An easy solution to fixing this problem would be for BBB to hold off for at least 1 or 2 hours before resetting any tribes after the timer runs down to zero. This would create a separation between the weeks. The first update that comes after the timer runs out would not be corrupt. The final updated scoreboard would be able to stand for at least 1 or 2 hours for everybody to see. Tribes could continue leveling up all the way until the timer hits zero, and they could be confident that their efforts would show up on the scoreboard.

We actually did think that BBB might have fixed the problem on the week that ended on 1/1/17. That would certainly have been fitting since it was New Years Day! The tribes did not begin resetting until several hours after the timer wound down to zero. We were very happy to see that we thought that BBB had finally fixed the problem! But we were very much letdown and disappointed to see that BBB had not fixed the problem when the reset returned to it’s previous condition the following week.

Or, BBB could also publish the final tribe scores on their Facebook page. But for whatever reason, BBB has chosen to not do anything about this problem.

If you are disturbed by the problems that come from the reset as it currently stands, it might be helpful to write to BBB to express your concerns. You can send the link to this post to BBB if you’d like. That will save you a lot of time writing to explain your opinion.

One final question to SPFC

A lot of people have noticed something very odd about your scores last week. You were at 7011 with 30 members on your tribe:

Corrupt update

After one player left early, your score dropped to 6541:

Lower score

That is a difference of 470 levels. Leveling up to 470 would cost a player 34,937,920 shards. That would leave all of the other members averaging around 225 or 226.

It would take most people at least a full year to collect that many shards. Why would this 470 level person leave before receiving their rewards? Why would somebody be willing to level up so much higher than everybody else? This person spent 10 times as many shards as the others on the team.

There have been many of us that have been very suspicious that you might be repeating some of your old behavior again*. We are always on the lookout for abnormal leveling on your tribe, as we have seen before. We have been very suspicious about this for a long time now. This increases our suspicions a lot.

Question to SPFC: Are you cheating again?

Please feel free to leave comments.

*Go to https://harmonious-bliss.com/cheating-history/ for more information about this ‘old behavior’.

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